Hi, everybody. I'm Josh Maekowits, and we are Talking Dateland. And today, our guest is Keith Morison.

Hi, Keith. Hello, Josh. How are you today?

Okay, that was great.

What do I say? I say hello. You said hello, Keith. I said hello, Josh.

It's starting right away. This episode is called The Sisterhood. Now, if you haven't listened to it or if you haven't watched it on television, the link to the episode is in the description to this episode. So go there, listen to it. You can also watch it on TV or stream it on Peacock, and then come back here. Now, today, Keith has a clip that he's going to play for us, interviews that did not make the episode. And then later, we will answer some of your questions about this broadcast from social media. So stick around for that. All right, here we go. It really is quite a journey, at least in the mind of the viewer, of Bob from good guy husband to hapless loser who can't really hold a job to widower to possible murderer. No one will hear you if you scream. I mean, he's going from Fred Flintstone to Hannibal Lector.

There is a character who appears often in fiction, and more often than we would like to think in real life as well. That character is one who puts on a pretty good impression in the first place and can dawn all kinds of disguises. But when it comes right down to it, he's a selfish person who really is not very ambitious about working and supporting a family. He just wants stuff. And that appears to have been what this situation was. He doesn't clean out the garage. He just pretends to clean out the garage. He doesn't go to work, really. He just keeps a job enough that he can say he works. And at the same time, he is a very controlling individual in the marriage. I want my I want my girls. I want to have something going on outside the marriage. And so even after he murdered her. Even after he was on bail awaiting trial, he was going for bicycle rides around the neighborhood where he wasn't supposed to be going and having dates with people.

Among all the horrific things that Bob was proven to have done and then also alleged to have done, I have to say that using grief counseling as a place to hook up with people would, for fall very near the top of the list, taking advantage of people who are really at their worst.

Well, when you know what happened back at the beginning, which was that he killed her Then he was going to a religious school and talking to people who run the religious school and picking up his children and bringing them home from school. He was able to hide himself during those occasions, and nobody knew otherwise. Frankly. He then put on such a show in his 911 call that that's one thing that the initial responders were a little suspicious of.

One, two, three, four, five, six, seven, eight, nine. Please help me, please. The help is on the way, sir. That's one thing I want to talk about is that 911 call. I thought it was great the way you play it at the beginning, and then at the end, you do the analysis of it with people who have listened to it more carefully. He sounds like he's calling for help, but he's really talking about himself, which I thought was interesting. He's using that. He's using his hysteria as a way of covering the fact that he's not actually doing anything. It reminded me a little bit of the IVF doctor that you did the story about.

A little bit, although the IVF doctor put on his... If he made an error in that 911 call, at least one that made people suspicious, it was that he adopted too much of the examination room attitude, my patient, and I'm a doctor, and I'm going to keep my cool.

Bob's hysterical, but he's not actually doing anything.

No, he actually wasn't doing anything. As we now know, those bruises on her body came from some other activity altogether.

Again, if we're to believe prosecutors, and clearly the jury did, then she was already dead at that point, not dying, not breathing her last. She was already gone at that point.

In which case- She had been gone for some time. Yeah.

In which case, Bob did not... I mean, again, if you're going to sell the idea that you are trying to bring this person back, this person you have just killed, you're going to have to do a better of it than that.

That is true.

You had great interviews in this. I mean, her friends were great. I thought the stuff about the dress, which they loaned back and forth, the sisterhood of the traveling dress. I thought that was something. And the detective, I thought was terrific because he felt it just like everybody else did.

He carried that case around with him for a long time, and I think it bothered him more deeply than I may have realized when we began to talk.

Yeah. And Susan McBride, who I think Bob thought, Okay, well, that didn't work out. I'm never going to hear from her again. And she ends up driving a stake into him.

Yeah, she was absolutely the key to the case. Without her, it wouldn't have happened. But again, it's the happenstance of things, right? If she just not kept in touch with the home front, because she went off to Italy, would she ever have known about Would she ever have contacted anybody?

Clearly, something made her want to investigate Bob a little bit more after the way he behaved, right? Now, plenty of women would just have thought, Okay, that guy's a loser. I'm going to block him on social media. I'm going to ignore his emails, and I'm going to move on to somebody else. I'm not going to look him up. I'm not going to discover that he's married. I'm not going to even have any debate about whether or not to contact his wife. But she did all of those things.

Yes. This woman figured out he was a cat after all, called the wife and blew the whistle. She thought she was doing a good thing, and then she went away. When she came back, she discovered that the victim had died that very day. It hit her like a Mac truck, as you can imagine. I made that call. I talked to that woman, and in a matter of hour or two later, she's dead. And so, yes, that's something that Susan has carried around with her. At the same time, It was her testimony that made the difference in convicting him.

The woman who was terribly attacked by Bob, that was a great interview. Was it difficult to get her to tell that story?

She was reluctant, yes. But she thought about it for a time and realized that it was an important story to tell. Often, women, in the experience of doing these stories, will tell us, tell me, and I'm sure they tell you, that somehow they feel like they can't really do anything like They are powerless in the face of somebody who has taken advantage of them or abused them. It doesn't matter what they say, it's not going to make a difference, but it does. This is one of the stories that indicates it truly does make a difference.

When we come back, we have more from Keith's interview with former prosecutor, Gail Strack, and attorney, Casey Gwyn.

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A beautiful doctor murdered her husband, heartbroken. Everyone just wanted to know who and why. An investigation that takes one surprising turn after another. This is a case of who done it.

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So I guess my first question about this is, How did this death go down as anything other than suspicious from the get-go? Because it feels like it took a long time to build suspicion about this. It seems like they bought it from the beginning, bought Bob's story.

This case took a long time to get to trial, to get to conclusion. Seven years was the process between the time she was killed and the time it was resolved. They thought he behaved a little oddly, and they thought, boy, there are a lot of abrasions and things on her body. But that makes sense because he dragged her out of the shower and took her into the middle of the room, and he was giving her CPR. The medical examiner who who did the autopsy could not find a cause of death right off the top. There was no obvious sign of strangulation, for example. There was no obvious sign of enough brute, blunt object force to kill her. So they just didn't know for sure. That detective was always suspicious, and he kept at it, but he was unable to move against the husband because he didn't have the medical examiner on side. There wasn't an indication it was actually a homicide, so he couldn't charge the guy. I think that the issue was that the medical examiner who looked at the body initially didn't recognize that that was potentially from a strangulation case.

One of the interesting things about this is that that initial determination by law enforcement or by a coroner or medical examiner, carries so much weight in so many of these cases that we've covered, and everything cascades from that, whether it's the weight of innocence or the weight of guilt.

Yeah, the The system is front loaded in that interesting way, but everything takes so long. The initial determination is so weighty, is so important that it takes a long, long time to undo that, to see a case from the other side. Did that happen in this case for sure?

Let's talk about the Training Institute for Strangulation Prevention. I've never heard of them before. How did you guys come across them? Tell me a little bit more about that.

Our victim's sister who located those people When we're doing the story and heard about them, they happen to be having a conference not far away from where both the producer and I live. That's where that interview came from that you will see in addition to the material here. It's a group who recognize that medical examiners, most prosecutors, most people in local law enforcement in the country, are only aware of one very specific injury from strangulation, and they miss a lot.

This feels like a good place to listen to this extra sound. If you want to see the full video of this, you can see it on our website. It's an interview with the former prosecutor, Gail Strack, and attorney, Casey Gwyn. They're talking about the Training Institute of Strangulation Prevention and what can be learned from their work. Let's listen to that. The Training Institute on Strangulation Prevention actually started probably in 1995.

Casey put me in charge of the domestic violence unit.

We had two teenagers. Both of them had been choked before they were killed. Neither case got prosecuted, and it really changed my life personally.

And ever since then, we've been trying to figure out what happened Can we make it better? And can we make it right? Strangulation has been missed for decades and decades in this country. There's no black eyes, there's no broken bones. And we didn't understand that for almost 30 years in our work as prosecutors and as social change advocates. But the other thing we didn't understand is that men who strangle women are not the same as men who push or slap or punch women. If you go after stranglers before they kill, you're getting the killers before the victim is dead.

Our work has prevented homicides in San Diego, in California, and across America. That is certainly provocative, the idea that strangling is is a precursor to domestic violence, which is in one form or another, so many dateland episodes and so many stories that we cover.

The idea that they have prevented deaths was something I wouldn't ever have considered. Maybe you discover a death, a reason for death that you weren't aware of. That seemed obvious. But to prevent them, well, I guess so. There's an assault on a woman, and if she is able to report what happened to her and they can have a proper look at the medical indicators, they can stop that person.

One of the things I really like about this episode is I always like it when we can take our eyes off the actual story that we're telling and do something a little bit bigger. In this case, talking about domestic violence and strangulation and the whole issue of controlling men like that and where that can lead.

Well, thank you, Josh. But it does go to the heart of what you and I do and have been doing for years, which is, as we set out to do these kinds of crime stories, we came to understand that these are stories of abuse largely of abusive husbands or abusive men who are damaging women. It's unfortunately very common.

If you or someone you know is experiencing domestic violence, you can call National Domestic Violence Hotline at 1-800-799-SAFE. After a break, we will be back to answer some of your questions from social media. Within a couple of seconds, there were a number of armed security with great big airport machine guns. An autism patient's daring escape from NHS psychiatric care pits her against some of the most powerful institutions in the state. From the multi-award-winning Sky News Storycast team, in partnership with the Independent, follow Patient Eleven wherever you get your podcasts. Hey, guys. Willy Geist here, reminding you to check out the Sunday Sit Down podcast.

On this week's episode, I get together with Glenn Powell to talk about his recent run of movies that have made him one of Hollywood's most in demand stars, from Top Gun Maverick to the blockbuster romantic comedy with Sydney Sweeney, Anyone But You, and now the new movie, Hitman, which he co-wrote and stars in. You can get our conversation now for free wherever you download your podcasts.

All right, let's look at some questions from social media. Joy Gimbal says, Chilling Story. I pray those kids are getting therapy to heal from years alone with their toxic father. Well, we're not going to know for a long time what the fallout of this is. That's one of the problems with this.

Right. Although there is a support group around those children, happily. So I think they're probably better off than many other children are in similar circumstances.

Something we were already talking about. Dr. Lyndon P. Says, Just listen to this episode. I think the investigation was shoddy. Two fentanyl patches, none in her blood. They must have been placed on her after death with none in the blood. One of the major red flags, poor work by all. It clearly did take a long time for this.

The fentanyl patch, yes. It's a fair point. And the Fentanyl patches were a tell that should have sent them off in a different direction right off the bat. You don't take a shower with two Fentanyl patches on your body.

I do want to say this, which is, frequently, when we do these stories, and it takes a very long time to try somebody, We can say, or it can be said, that the delay didn't really have any result. It didn't matter. But they didn't kill anybody else in the interim. They did eventually go to in prison for killing their wife or husband. But in this case, that's not true. That delay allowed Bob Feldman to do some terrible things.

Sure. And it could have been more terrible. We could have had a repeat of the reason that he was on trial.

Girl, that Jay says, Good for you, Susan. Retaining those emails from Nasty Bob Feldman. Yeah, good for her. Again, there would be ample reason and precedent, and no one would ever wonder if she just thought, That guy's a loser. That guy's a jerk. That guy's a liar. I don't like the way he's acting towards you. Just erase it all. Yeah, that's it. I'm done with you forever. Instead, she kept going, dug into it. Good for her. Here's somebody who wrote, An awkward swim with Bob Feldman is my new band name. That does have a great punk rock ring to it, I have to say. It just shows you if If you have a pool, you'll have a lot of friends.

Sure. A pool in Denver and places like that, especially, there aren't quite as many pools as there are right around where you live. I know, Josh.

No, it's just one big pool here in California. I don't personally have one because you probably do. You do. You're probably cleaning it this morning, aren't you? I see you with one of that big long thing fishing the leaves out of there and holding this glass of in the other hand while you're doing it, saying, you know.

That would be perfect, wouldn't it? Is that a leaf on the bottom of the pool?

I have something that I've got for you that I keep waiting to see you in person so I can give it to you. It's a fabulous wine glass, which-Oh, my God, look at that. I have something white behind it so that people can see it a little better. There, it's got your-Look at that. Your sketch on it, which is pretty good. What does it say there?

There's some printing there.

What does that say? It says here, An ordinary glass of wine, or was it?

Or was it?

So this is going to be yours someday when next we meet.

That's very kind.

This has been waiting for you for a long time. I've been meaning to give this to you, and then I never see you.

So how are we going to arrange to get this thing transferred?

I don't know. Maybe, yeah, give it to one of the producers who sees you more than I do, which would be all I love them. Keith, as always, it's been a pleasure. And when I say pleasure, I'm making quote marks with my fingers.

I'm so touched by that.

Very impressed. I knew you would be. That's Talking Dateland for this week. Remember, if you have any questions for us about stories or about Dateland, you can reach out to us on social at @datelandnbc. See you Fridays on Dateland on NBC.

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